Arundel elects Robbins, rejects school budget
ARUNDEL - Voters in Arundel sent a clear message asking for change, electing Diane Robbins to a three-year seat on the RSU 21 Board of Directors over incumbent Leia Lowery and for a second time rejecting the district's proposed budget.
Robbins took 370 votes to Lowery's 198, and voters rejected the budget 189 to 368.
Voters also elected a new selectman, with Tom Danylik beating Michael Drew 369 votes to 184.
Let's just hope that Diane is able to put away the soap box and work collaboratively, or there will be plenty of us who are 'disgusted' with the representation she provides.
ReplyDeleteNote to Diane: There are many of us who wanted the contract bought out. There are many of us who wanted to see a relatively equitable cost sharing proposal. You helped encourage the opposite vote.
As a new board member, how do you make reparations for those actions? My first suggestion would be to move that the language of the contract be changed to allow for choice.
If that doesn't work, find a legislator to either amend the legislation that allows this contract to supersede Maine law, or to write new legislation that expands school choice to RSU 21 for middle school children.
Those of us who live in the district and pay for both middle schools are going to actively pursue a resolution to this matter; you'd start off on the right foot by supporting us as publicly as you supported voting no on the budget.
Interesting. I have a different perception, and a question.
ReplyDeleteMy question would be, what are the "reparations" we can expect to see from current board members - the ones who ranted, raved, pounded their fists, and harassed local citizens that didn't support their view of the "facts" during this election process?
The comment from "Anonymous" brilliantly displays the blatant double standard currently at play in our district.
It's ludicrous to criticize Ms. Robbins for her choice to oppose the TAMS buyout, and for what she's stated in public, while FAILING to demand an apology from some current board members for their own behavior and public statements.
Astounding.
What's equally puzzling is why some people refuse to sign their name to comments on public forums like this one. Is their apparent fear truly valid, or are they just plain old cowards?
- Naran Row-Spaulding, Kennebunk.
I believe the forum creator stated this is a place for debate, free of the requirement of self-identification.
ReplyDeleteIt's ludicrous to assume that by one previous statement, that I don't have opinions about other board members as well. I prefer to stay on topic, however.
I think it would behoove Ms. Robbins to start building bridges, because of the divisiveness over the past 18 months. I believe she should work to repair relationships between citizens in her immediate community, and work to facilitate a better relationship between her immediate community and the two other communities that make up the school district she will now serve.
Double standard what? Point one out.
Bridges? There is no bridge, the bridges could have been built with Ed Karytko and Bob Higgins, and they didn't get elected. Your double standard is walking all over Diane, but you want her to support you? Your bridge you want will fall down because there is no foundation. Sounds pretty silly, and does sound like a double standard to me...are you the Good Lord Almighty? Arundel doesn't agree with you, Arundel has never approved an RSU 21 Budget, and Arundel voted in a new board member, all not to "your liking". Sorry, but I agree with Naran, and as some people still have to live in this town, I refuse to post my name because of the consequences that we all suffer because there is no Unity! I won't post my name in fear of people like you. You are a bully. Sad thing is, if you have kids they will grow up just like you. A bad message to be sending.
ReplyDeleteI would only hope that Diane does not turn into a fist pounding, screaming, whining board member, who pounces on the citizens that they represent, and foot the bill.
ReplyDeleteI echo the sentiment of the poster above me. Diane's public antics are no more respectful than those of Mr. Domine. If you're content to live within a community and self-isolate, you should have found a cave somewhere. Now that the budget has passed, it is time to *really* begin working together.
ReplyDeleteArundel has maintained a grudge for far too long, and too many public faces have allowed and encouraged that grudge to fester into what it became during the May vote - one of spite and anger, instead of a thoughtful, educated process.
Diane has stated that she will represent the community. My suggestion that she work to bridge the three towns is a double standard? How?
How is it that I am someone you should be afraid of? I have expectations of the school board; you should have the same. Accountability, responsibility and leadership are expectations one should have of those in charge of steering the ship that is our school district. Is that wrong? I don't think so.
Let me pose this question: Your position is to walk all over the rest of the board (by calling my statement a double standard, and saying that bridges cannot/won't be built); is it not a double standard on your part to be stubborn and refuse to collaborate?
I realize there's no point in advancing a conversation about this with people who state openly they're fearful of progressive thinking, so consider the question rhetorical.
It's a bad message to send to say that there will never be bridges built. If you choose cognitive dissonance, that *is* your choice, but don't speak for those of us who have hope that the childish behavior, the bullying, the grandstanding, and the coercive actions can be stopped, and a mature group of individuals can work together to create a unified school district.
If it's too late for you personally, step aside and let those of us who want the work to get done do so.
Wow!
ReplyDeleteIndeed. It's shocking that one could even confidently say that 900-odd people speak for the entire town, when only 30% of the registered voters in the town showed up after not previously participating in the process to shoot down something they were comfortable not apprising themselves of.
ReplyDeleteMoreover, it's ludicrous to state that 500-odd people speak for the entire town when that's only 19% of the registered voters living in our town.
The TAMS Buy-out supporters have a lot of work to do, the bridges they say that they are trying to build is not. Instead of whining and crying that you didn't get what you want, the town spoke. It is what it is. The selfishness has built the "Great Wall of Arundel", and I would think that as creative as all of you buy-out supporters can be, you can think of another way to productively work with the democratic process instead of trying to force others out by telling us we should go back in our caves. Cognitive dissonance? Interestingly enough how about cause and effect? What ever happened to being a good citizen and treating people with dignity and respect? This is children we are talking about here. Like I said before, try working on taking down the "Great Wall of Arundel" first. Seems to me that you are having great difficulty with the democratic process, sorry you are so angry.
ReplyDeleteWho's whining? I'm stating that now that there's a Board member who claims they'll represent our community, she should be held to that statement.
ReplyDeleteI'm ready willing and able to work with and for the people in this district and town. By someone above making the statement bridges will not and cannot be built, the finger should be pointed in their direction RE: "the great all of Arundel".
I didn't create the mess by voting to consolidate. I didn't create the bullying or childish behavior. I didn't choose to participate in baiting and fearmongering. I am proposing that the town get it's 'stuff' together, put on its thinking cap and figure out how to UNITE.
Bashing the comments I've made certainly doesn't point us in that direction, does it?
I understand that text doesn't convey sentiment or emotion, but there is nothing in my commentary or how I feel about the process that is 'angry', simply because I see the forest for the trees.
I'm sorry that you can't set aside your self-righteous attitude and translate what I'm communicating into something of value. Your responses do the exact opposite of what I'm stating needs to be done.
*wall, not "all"
ReplyDeleteKindness, dignity and respect! Self-righteous? Hmm...? TAMS buy-out supporters with the help of RSU 21 built the "Great Wall of Arundel," I'd like to know how you plan to draw me in by calling my attitude self-righteous? You've added another stone to the wall, you are the one who told me to go back in my cave and step aside, there is a couple of more stones. I'd actually like to see consolidation work, but with the continual bashing of the democratic process and the delivering of stones I don't see how that is going to work. What is your plan? Do you think we all should just forgive in forget? Should there be compromise? Should we all just forget that with surveys, meetings, and ignoring the results are in the best interest of the town? She would just forget what the votes were, and doctor them up? It's not easy on either end. I'd love for all of RSU 21 middle schoolers and highschoolers to have choice so everyone can be happy. Maybe you should speak with Rep. Parry to make that happen. Who is really holding back the relationship with the communities? I believe it is RSU 21, and I'd like to see the board members take the stones down on the wall one by one. I hope your vision and plan works, but if you do not get the rest of Arundel on board with you, it will fail, and I am not sold on it. Seriously, what is the vision and how do you plan on achieving the goal taking into consideration how Arundel feels? There are a few who are satisfied with RSU 21, but I don't believe it is the majority.
ReplyDeleteForgive and forget? Absolutely. There is no *way* the town is going to be able to work together if they do not let go of the anger they've held on to since the consolidation happened.
ReplyDeleteCompromise? Absolutely!
Ignore the surveys? No way! But ignore the remaining families who feel differently than the majority disenfranchises them as much as Arundel citizens claim they have been disenfranchised during this entire process. Is there a way to change this and come to a compromise? Absolutely! Will it happen? Nope. Why? Because of the administration at a school who doesn't want to lose our money.
What's the cost of sending a student to TAMS, minus transportation, special ed, fuel, etc? A little over 7K, yes? So let's do some math. $7K x 15 = $105K. What's the total school budget? I'd like to know if there *truly* would be a school closure if their budget had a $100K shortfall.
I've spoken with Rep. Parry. He indicated to me that he 'was not aware' of any issue regarding the vote that came up in May, and that he had not been contacted by any constituents in our area for or against the topics that were being discussed. I'd be happy to copy and paste his email here, when I have access later in the evening. I was rather dismayed to get such a response from someone who is a representative of our community, and further dismayed to learn he was also out promoting TAMS on the other side of his mouth.
I think that there is no need to convince those satisfied with TAMS to think otherwise; I support their support of the school they like. What I think is important is to get them to understand that school choice is nothing to be afraid of, and I think it's important that they also hold the administrators at TAMS accountable for allowing their fears and concerns to go unaddressed during this process.
There is no way to state that the majority of Arundel feels the way you do or I do, because the majority of registered voters in Arundel didn't involve themselves, show up and vote.
The majority of the people that did show up and shoot the budget down, though, were led to believe inaccuracies and mistruths. They were told taxes would increase if the contract was bought out, and if the cost sharing proposal was approved.
Sadly, taxes will increase next year, because the tax relief they pushed for this year is the money that would have bought out the remaining five years of a contract that will now cost us all $5M over the remainder of that contract.
Taxes will increase, and we *didn't* buy out the contract. Taxes will increase, because the method by which we each share the burden of the district responsibility will remain as it is now, which was something Arundel voters felt was unfair to begin with.
I hope that you can understand my disbelief at how someone could vote in a manner which is counter intuitive to their desires, and counter intuitive to the cohesion of a community and district.
You are not going to like this, but the wounds still have not healed, and forgiving and forgetting right now is not possible with the lack of trust, and current attitudes.
ReplyDeleteThe contract costs are much higher than what they should be, because of the breaking of the contract. As I have stated before, RSU 21 has not helped the relationship with Arundel, TAMS, and RSU 21. The savings on the contract would have been tuition savings, and those saving would have been shifted into the line item expenses of educating at MSK. Education isn't free. To say the district would have no additional costs to educate Arundel students is not an accurate assumption. With an increase or decrease of students per pupil costs either go up or down. It's kind of like saying, we can educate 10 Kennebunk or Kennebunkport students for free if we get 10 Arundel students.
The stones need to be taken down one by one the same way they went up. If this doesn't happen, sadly, there is no way the relationship with Arundel and RSU 21 is going to work.
The votes are what they are, and if those who were passionately in support of the budget, and candidates they would have come out and voted. The vote happened the way it did because of the lack of trust for RSU 21. Why would anyone vote otherwise?
The only way this relationship could work is if we were all fairly assessed. The entire cost sharing formula needs to be adjusted to 100% property valuation. We are the poorest of the 3 towns, and we are paying the most. The last proposed formula would have only been for new debt, ie: building renovations. It didn't fix the problem only put a band-aid on the problem.
I totally understand. I do, but it takes *someone* to let that go, and while difficult, it *can* happen. If both sides stonewall because of their respective differences and hurt feelings, no one is going to have made a move forward.
ReplyDeleteWhat would it take for Arundel to take the first step? I feel like that's where it should start. I feel that there should be a community gathering or group meeting to address this; we are all neighbors, families, friends, business partners. This town needs the support of *everyone*, not just 19% or 30%.
I also agree with you about property valuation being the basis for the cost sharing proposal. HOWEVER: I think it unfair to use outdated information, and that a *current*, to-date valuation should be undertaken before the next year's budget is presented. I'd venture to guess that some of the pain felt on Arundel's end might be alleviated, if that were to happen.
For that to happen, more people need to be present at the finance committee meetings; more people need to show up and speak to those matters, and more people need to understand that the school board works for them. This should be an *empowering* moment to capitalize on.
It needs to start with RSU 21 Board Members, the leaders, not Arundel.
ReplyDeleteI like the agreement! In addition to the cost sharing proposal it should be done before any new debt is taken on, ie: building renovations.
So your comment in response really ties into my statement about Diane needing to help build bridges. She may be new to the board, but she could certainly work to facilitate.
ReplyDeleteI have always felt that the disproportionate share was, well, disproportionate, and that if we were to base our numbers on property value, at this point, Arundel's burden would decrease (likely significantly). Given the market, it would likely decrease all around, but our town specifically might see some much needed relief.
The numbers should reflect the reality of the economy at this point, with regard to how the burden is distributed.
Not really, from my stand point, Diane hasn't even gotten out of the starting gate, she just got elected. Everyone needs to give her a chance. Diane will do what is best for Arundel as a whole.
ReplyDeleteThink about this, anything that benefits Arundel will benefit Kennebunk. Kennebunkport would ultimately have an increase.
The numbers at this point looking into other RSU's, 21 is the highest. The budget doesn't reflect the reality of Arundel's economy. Unemployment in Arundel is at it's highest in history, another reason why the budget didn't pass in Arundel. All of this does tie in. An understanding of Arundel's economics is critical to RSU 21 remaining RSU 21. The leaders need to lead the way, all of them including Domine.
However, many of the VOTE NO people last night just voted a 13% increase in our municipal budget....hmmmm seems to me that it never was about taxes, but rather a personal interest group that used that tactic to strike fear into our community. What they just voted in, with out a doubt is far more damning in taxes than the 1% that the school was going to ask for... and that was because of the lower state contributions.... I just think that if you are going to scream about taxes, it should be across the board, not only in one direction where people seem to have an axe to grind...
ReplyDeleteI agree with that statement as well. Taxes are taxes are taxes.
ReplyDeleteI took a look at the budget and it appears that there's a pretty good chunk in surplus - why wasn't that applied toward the budget for some relief? Was any explanation given?
"Building bridges" starts with people putting aside the heated rhetoric. The first post on this page was combative in tone, and seemed entitled. Demanding certain things, and saying that you'll be "disgusted" if you don't get them does not set the stage for a civilized conversation about the issues.
ReplyDeleteThere has been plenty of "soap box" on either side of the TAMS issue. Domine's performance at the 5/27 school board meeting far exceeded any heated discourse I've seen from Ms. Robbins. King and Lowery weren't far behind on that day, either. Everybody needs to take a step back, and ask the same of others, as well.
As to the real topic - yes, Ms. Robbins has stated that she will represent the entire Arundel community. I believe she is sincere in that intention.
However, that doesn't mean she won't vote according to her conscience, and in line with her perception of the greater good for the whole community. Public officials are not robots, who can be programmed to vote the way one particular segment of the community would prefer.
Regardless, those who want their children to attend MSK and KHS need to work within the system, collaboratively, instead of insisting on a contract buyout that was divisive and damaging to their community.
Working for district-wide school choice is something that should be examined. It may not be possible, for various different reasons, but that remains to be seen.
Far better, however, to pursue something of that kind than to breach a contract that had been negotiated in good faith.
ps - when it comes to surplus, every community needs to have some money in an account towards major capital expenses, or an emergency repair. The usual amount cited by the MMA and accountants is two months of the annual, average cash expenditure by the town.
ReplyDeleteIf there is money in excess of that two months, it should be looked at for reducing the mil rate, and thus, the tax bills.
"However, that doesn't mean she won't vote according to her conscience, and in line with her perception of the greater good for the whole community. Public officials are not robots, who can be programmed to vote the way one particular segment of the community would prefer."
ReplyDeleteThey are not robots, but Arundel has strongly stated that they feel they do not have adequate representation, and Diane has stated she feels she could do the job. Arundel residents will now expect that she will listen to and carry out the wishes of her constituents and community.
I believe the community has the power, and the representative has the obligation to represent the community, with the exception of decisions that would be an obvious detriment to that community.
For example, I don't believe it's in Arundel's best interest to withdraw from the RSU. It's a financial risk bigger than I believe the town could manage at this point. It would be to the community's detriment if Diane decided this was a matter to vote "according to her conscience", because there are many out there who know where she has stated she stands on this matter, and who feel as I do.
I'm not sure why you're still pushing the contract buyout topic - it's done and over with. It won't be brought up again at a Board meeting, it won't be presented for a public vote, and it won't be renewed by the school district. I thought that had been iterated already.
We've neglected our town since consolidation. There was no ax grinding, it's merely supporting town government. Flat budgets were run because of the impact of RSU 21 increases. That mere statement doesn't help in building bridges in fact it is offensive. RSU 21 needs to get a bit more creative about the way they spend money. Arundel has compromised enought, time to bridge the gap and RSU 21 board members to start behaving themselves and be the leaders that they say they are.
ReplyDeleteYou have to admit, though, it certainly looks like it when close to a thousand voters (which, again, is only 30% of the voting population in Arundel) show up to vote 'no' across the board, and on a re-vote, only 500-odd folks show up when only the budget is presented.
ReplyDeleteMaybe if it weren't a lump-sum vote, it would have gone differently, but there were failures on both sides of the fence with regard to how the information was presented (or not), and there were very few meetings (only one, that I can recall) where both voters, board and administration from TAMS were all present at the same time to discuss one of the contentious topics.
I believe if there had been an open forum that involved *everyone*; that allowed all discussion, debate, examination of numbers, and that was honest, that the vote MAY have gone differently. I don't believe folks were given all the information they needed, and I believe they were given information that did not spell things out plainly. That lead, in part, to mistrust and anger.
It is *everyone's* responsibility to move the town and district forward. Not just 500+ people, and not just the school board. Arundel isn't the only town whose voter turnout was abysmal, but given the topics voted on in May and the turnout then, and the topics voted on a few days ago and that turnout, those who didn't show up should make it a point to do so at each and every opportunity.
It would be irresponsible if the budget didn't pass.
ReplyDeleteAbsolutely. But it was irresponsible to take 1.2M and apply it toward a one-time tax relief, leaving very little (in comparison to the total district budget) to work with during a time of need.
ReplyDelete$1.2M could have better served reinstating some of those positions that were cut drastically, or toward the mold mitigation, or toward other needed repairs/maintenance.
Next year, when the budget is presented, there will likely be a financial shortfall, as this year. Health insurance costs never *decrease*, so we can at the very least anticipate that if they do not hold at the current rate, they will go up. The cost sharing proposal, if there is no further conversation or change, stays the way it is currently, without the buffer from that $1.2M.
Do you see where this is going?
No time to argue! You can go on and on about how people didn't do what you thought they should do, it doesn't change anything.
ReplyDeleteI see where all this is going, RSU 21 and Arundel will not have a relationship. It's not amicable because of the attitude.
Why spend 1.2M on Arundel when Arundel didn't want the buy out to happen? If they really want it to work they will step up and do the right thing. If not, Arundel is able, ready and willing to withdraw.
SAD 71 didn't take care of the mold problem since the birth of MSK, and we are footing the bill for their negligence. Those teachers who are ill, will be on steroids for the rest of their lives.
I really don't have time to dispute points. I remain firm, RSU 21 Board Members need to work on the relationship and repairing the wounds that they inflicted on Arundel, if not, RSU 21 will not be.
What, exactly are we arguing about? I was just saying that $1.2M could have been used better. Don't you agree with that?
ReplyDeleteI feel that as a one-time tax relief, that was not responsible, and threw out examples of what it *could* have been used for. That's it. Doesn't mean I was married to those ideas. If there was something Arundel needed that money for, I'd be happy to support that.
I believe your perception that there's an argument is where some of the problem lies. I'm not your enemy, and don't consider you mine. As I've already stated, we're neighbors by virtue of the town in which we live.
I've asked how the back and forth can be resolved, and you're placing the responsibility squarely and solely with the Board. That can't be the only way to make it work; Arundel needs to do some work of their own, instead of remaining defiant of the fact that we're part of the district, and hanging onto anger.
I've even thrown out ways in which that can happen. It's clear to see that you aren't interested in fostering a collaborative, cooperative environment, that's entirely your choice. But you'll continue to be angry if you don't step up to the plate and participate in exactly that fashion, because people will not *want* to hear what you have to say, if all you can do is redirect and project.
Anonymous wrote(btw - which one? Pick a number, please!) :)
ReplyDelete"I believe if there had been an open forum that involved *everyone*; that allowed all discussion, debate, examination of numbers, and that was honest, that the vote MAY have gone differently. I don't believe folks were given all the information they needed, and I believe they were given information that did not spell things out plainly..."
*********
Here's the problem, in a nutshell. You don't like the voting results, and so, you say "if only people would have UNDERSTOOD, the vote might have been different."
What if you're wrong? What if people clearly understood, had the information, and just didn't approve of the voting issue?
Time after time, I see the same thing happen with election results. When the vote goes the way someone likes, they are just fine with the turnout and the results. When the results go against what they wanted, then the turnout is terrible, and things need to change.
Myself, I want more people to come out and vote because they should do so. We only had a 19% turnout in Kennebunk. Dismal. Frankly, I couldn't care less which way the vote goes, as long as people make their wishes known by casting a ballot.
PS - for the purposes of clarity, could those posting as "Anonymous" please somehow identify themselves, by a number, a letter, etc?
ReplyDeleteIt really would make the conversation easier to follow... thank you for any consideration of this idea.
"Myself, I want more people to come out and vote because they should do so. We only had a 19% turnout in Kennebunk. Dismal. Frankly, I couldn't care less which way the vote goes, as long as people make their wishes known by casting a ballot. "
ReplyDeleteThis is my point as well - 19% of the vote doesn't speak for *everyone*. People in their communities are disenfranchised - how do we get them to step up and say what *they* want and feel? How do we ramp up energy to be involved in local politics so that *everyone* (or almost everyone) participates?
I firmly believe that if more people came out and voted, it MAY have gone differently. That 81% of the voters did not come out says that they were unaware, uninformed and/or uninterested. ALL of those pieces need to change, because the things voted upon affect 100% of the town, not just the 19% who voted.
If people can let the personal stuff go, we will all benefit. One of the leaders of the Anti RSU group, sat at the table when the vote was ultimately made to join with MSAD71, and clearly stated he would have chosen to join with Saco, "..because it is personal...you have not heard the last from me..." After more than a year of planning, he had nothing to back up his choice, other than it was personal. Clearly he did not represent the best interest of the Town or it's people in mind. The budget is less after two years of a consolidated district, and after 3 straight years of major increases as a stand alone unit.( 3 years of increases with very little improvement at MLD. mostly due to contractual cost.) Unfortunatley, he has made it personal, and has no problem using what ever tactic he can to make it difficult for the RSU. He was invited to work with the RSU. He stated he would never support the RSU. He goes out of his way to be a thorn in the side of the RSU, when after serving on the School board in Arundel for as many years as he did, he should know full well just how good this is for Arundel. Certainly after 12 years on the board, he must be able to offer something to help improve the system. Unfortunatley he could care less. He is a TA graduate with a personal vendetta againt the Kennebunks. Placing signs to vote no on the budget that is less than when we joined? Voting no on the budget that has finaly provided the appropriate level of support in our only school, MLDay? The same person who says vote no to measures that control spending and keep $$ in district? Sounds like a very personal issue that is being made public. What is sad, is that there are so many people who follow. Like the woman who was coming out of the poll and asked, " We were suposed to vote NO right?" My response, " I think you were suposed to do research on the issue and form your own opinion." How sad it is, that people will follow someone with a personal grudge, rather than do a little bit of research and form their own opinion. To the people in Arundel who realy care: Do a little bit of research and you will find, given the state of the state, this is a good deal for Arundel. If only something could be worked out with TA so that kids who start in the K-12 system are not forced out for 6th grade,or have to pay tuition on top of taxes, this would be a GREAT system. Great for the taxpayer. Great for the RSU, Great for the MLDay School and Great for ALL of the residents in all three towns. Maybe it would not be great for the guy with the personal agenda! WHO CARES?
ReplyDeleteAnonymous wrote:
ReplyDelete"People in their communities are disenfranchised - how do we get them to step up and say what *they* want and feel? How do we ramp up energy to be involved in local politics so that *everyone* (or almost everyone) participates?"
**********
Sorry, but I don't think people are "disenfranchised." That would apply if they didn't have an opportunity to vote, and free absentee ballots, long voting windows (30-45 days, depending on the election), etc.
Having spent a very long time as a taxpayer advocate, I can assure you there is no way to make people vote. One can encourage, and prompt, and remind, but short of issuing free ice cream (beer?) certificates, I don't know the answer to increasing turnout.
This last election in Kennebunk, I stood in our town hall with the Deputy Town Clerk, commiserating over the lousy turnout numbers. I wish it were legal to implement a 10% property tax rebate for everyone who shows up to vote at least once a year.
I know it's not legal, but dang -- it would certainly increase the turnout.
lol
Matt - with respect, it sounds as if you could take your own advice, and let go of the personal stuff. It's clear who you're writing about. Wouldn't that post be better going directly to the gentleman in question, instead of being posted on this page?
ReplyDeleteJust a thought.
It would be interesting to get town demographics. Does age determine who does/does not show up? (Are there elderly residents not in assisted living facilities who do not have transportation?)
ReplyDeleteAre numbers low due to income? (i.e. families who have to work a few jobs to make ends meet - maybe they can't get to town hall/an absentee ballot)
How accurate *are* the registered voter lists? Are there people who are on the list who may have moved? How often are they updated?
It's just crazy to think that 81% of the town didn't vote. I wonder if a town survey (anonymous, of course) were conducted (i.e., A recent school budget vote was scheduled, what were the primary reasons you did not vote?) what the response would be.
Anyone can call town hall and have an absentee ballot mailed to them. They can sign it, and mail it back to town hall. They can also send someone to pick up the ballot at town hall for them. I have done this myself. The person picking it up signs a form, and again if they drop it off at town hall. It can also be returned via US mail.
ReplyDeleteI know the "busy-ness" angle does come into play for some families, who are so rushed they literally feel they don't have time. Perhaps if they understood how important it is to vote, they would make a better effort. Their children aren't learning good lessons about being a citizen, if their parents never vote.
This is one reason I support the new legislation mandating a Civics Class for high school graduation. I think some people have forgotten how important our rights, and civic duties, really are.
Hi Naran, I have multiple times e-mailed the person I refered to and he claims to never had recieved them. Then in the same conversation I was asked why he should have responded, so I could use the information against his cause? My e-mails were sent around the time of the meetings at the Golf Course. My mentioning this information on this site today was intended to paint a picture of why it is important to do the research and be informed. Merely getting people to the polls is not always most important. Getting people to the polls who are informed is important. Don't take my word for it, don't take your word for it, and don't take his word for it. Do the research get involved. I wonder, how did you know who I was talking about?
ReplyDelete"Feminine Intuition."
ReplyDeletelol
Self correction - my email was to Alan Casavant, not Parry - I emailed him at the same time as Alan, but received no response.
ReplyDeleteI was well informed and educated on the vote. As far as the relationship, it was RSU 21 Board Members that broke the bank on that one. They helped lead the way to build the Great Wall of Arundel for the lack of listening to what we were telling them. It started with the survey, ignoring the results, and wanting to buy out a contract beyond what Arundel wanted. The agenda continued, and there has not been a change with the relationship with Arundel, directly fueled by the choices that RSU 21 Board Members make. It continued through out the cost-sharing formula process and not fixing the problem, and then board members publicly bashing Arundel citizens in board meetings, and on the Unity Page. You don't keep sticking your hand in a burning fire. People no longer talk to each other because of this. I have nothing left to give RSU 21, and I am forced to give them money, and they so strongly refuse to hear, or take into consideration any piece of Arundel except for those who have their view, their vision. So, if the wall comes down, it will be the work of the board members they easily put it up, lets see how they take it down. I say this is good spirit with hope that they will try to fix the problem. As I stated before they are the leaders in all of this, not Arundel citizens.
ReplyDeleteWas putting up the wall refering to the contract buyout? Of course it is. I am not condoning the actions of the board in general as profesionalism is of the most importance. If it is about the contract consider this.
ReplyDeleteParents in Arundel have asked multiple times to allow their kids to attend MSK. Taxpayers want Tax releif. TA will not negotiatate a deal with the RSU to allow kids to attend MSK. Option to buy out contract= If as many parents that have asked, decided to have kids attend MSK, the contract would have been paid for quickly and enabled a return very quickly. Said return goes to the bottom line and helps control the climb in taxes. So the board tried to build a bridge between education and the taxpayer. Taxpayer said NO. Taxpayer to keep paying, keep complaining. Parents forced to a school outide of district.
Now what? Keep fighting about contract, or have TA try to work with RSU to do what is right for EDUCATION? The RSU agreed to pay TA anyway. Why hold kids hostage?
$$$
ReplyDeleteAfter an in-person conversation with the administrator, that is ALL it's about. You couldn't sugar coat the conversation I had with him if you had a dump truck full of it. The message was clear: I want your money.
Let's hope his successor isn't his protege, and thinks outside the box.
Relying primarily on Arundel to fund that school is going to lead to eventual closure (how many of us plan on cranking out kids to keep that school open..anyone?).
It's not the majority of parents asking to attend MSK, but neglect on board members to take into consideration the survey results. It's not the TA contract, it's multiple times of increasing taxes when employees in our own town have not received pay increases due to the impact of RSU 21 budgets. The RSU agreed to pay TA anyway on our dollar. Absolutely the wrong thing to do. They broke the contract purposely to renegotiate. If anyone wanted to renegotiate it should have been in an honest and legal manner. A waste of money. We were all here when all of this stuff happened, and it's still going to happen. RSU 21 should have done the right thing in the first place, a bad message sent to all children. "So what, the law doesn't matter, I don't like the contract, so I am going to break it, and I am going to take tax payer money to fight for the bad mistake." Shame on them. There is no trust, I don't trust them now, and until they prove otherwise I remain firm. TA is not that unreasonable to hold anyone hostage. I would think that there are many kids at MSK or KHS who would love the opportunity to attend TA, so why not let them? It's still money being spent on children in the district. For all reasons stated in any of these posts the majority rules. Arundel has never accepted an RSU 21 Budget, and has never rejected an Arundel School Budget. With the thought process on many of these posts, the relatationship will remain not amicable, because RSU 21 will not ever allow kids from MSK or KHS to attend TA. If you even think that the potential for this to happen, just ask in a public meeting. You'll get the same answer I have gotten, no way.
ReplyDeleteWhat? Not sure what law was broken. Contract said a disagrement would go to arbitration. Arbitrator states multiple interpretations of contract. As for the budget. Expalin why you would not approve a budget that has barely grown since the RSU was formed? If Arudnel was a stand along community, and paid for what we have on our own, we would be broke. Don't forget. Arundel depended heavily on state $$ to fund schools. Funding is shrinking faster than we could ever have afforded. Can't blame the RSU for everytihng.
ReplyDeleteArrogance and ignorance all mixed up into one. The Great Wall of Arundel just keeps getting longer and higher!
ReplyDeleteIgnorance does not equal stupidity, FYI. And what is arrogant about the poster's statement?
ReplyDeleteI think I will just sit back, not posting any conversation with you again, you just don't seem to get it, you don't get that Arundel doesn't trust the RSU, and because you do your expectation of everyone else as you believe should be at your level...sorry, tired of being screwed over. My statement was arrogance and ignorance all mixed up into one, FYI arrogantly stupid and proud of it! Mindless souls. Have fun with all the fluff, glitter, and bubbles and the unicorn flying through the air. WEEEE!
ReplyDeleteWith that kind of attitude, no progress will be made. I get that you don't trust the RSU; you couldn't possibly have phrased it more than you already have. However, that shouldn't preclude you from being a leader in your community and fostering a relationship with your neighbors that helps to get everyone to a better place. I hate to break it to you, but the school board isn't going to visit Arundel, apologize for what you perceive to be their inadequacies, and hold your hand until you feel everything is made right.
ReplyDeleteIt starts with you. And me. And that guy over there. And that lady. And her friends. Everyone in Arundel. Only when we are all collaborating, instead of shooting off our mouths at each other; only when we have a common goal that betters the community and unites the district, will we all have succeeded.
I'm sorry you're hurt and angry. But holding in that anger and not doing something productive with it is only going to keep you right where you are.
I do so, so, wish you folks would at least use a letter or a number. Trying to keep the comments straight is impossible!
ReplyDelete:)
I do not believe the anonymous poster said that (s)he would like to have RSU 21 come and apologize. I think it is more about the actions of RSU 21 will be a deciding factor. More likely then not, this is not the place to be voicing any concerns and should be directly handled in meetings. RSU 21 has had 3 years to Unite a district, and hasn't done so yet, what makes you think that it is going to happen now? As a citizen I can understand his/her frustration with the district, with a town turned upside down would make one a bit angry. Your comments are not helping the issue but causing more of a divide, example:telling someone how they feel with out them telling you and making an assumption, feelings really have nothing to do with this, it is about being fiscally responsible, and taking Arundel into consideration. As with any marriage you wouldn't stay in a marriage if your spouse mistreats you daily.
ReplyDeleteKeep running over the nail that causes the flat? RSU supporters, the RSU needs a major turn-over of attitude, and empathy for the communities in which it educates.
ReplyDeleteI know how the person feels because they told me as such. I just don't think that they should expect any more from the Board than they've already seen with regard to their statements that the Board is responsible for taking the first step.
ReplyDeleteIt appears as if the town and the Board are in standoff phase, progress is in the strip of 'no man's land' between them, and it is as simple as someone stepping forward to meet the other side.
I understand that there are complexities and nuances to both the perception of the Board and the consolidation process as a whole.
I'm just saying Arundel should lay down the hammer/axe (whichever metaphor works here) and be the first to take that step. Either within the community, reaching out to those folks who feel the same but want to see positive outcomes, or with the Board, to work together to get to a place where positive outcomes can happen.
I believe that if Diane Robbins has the best interests of our children and district in mind, she has the ability to be the facilitator for that to happen, but only time will tell.
Aside from the recent meetings which have been contentious, what gives people in Arundel their deep set idea that the Board doesn't care?
I ask, because I don't know the complete history, and I'd like some perspective.
Arundel has nothing else left to give. The board (not just Robbins) will help facilitate which direction the town goes. (1)
ReplyDeleteThe problem lies with funding. Arundel can not afford to go back to the way it was. 6-12 + Special Ed, Transportation, facilities, labor, are all out of our control, or fixed costs. We could not cut anymore, and funding was shrinking faster than support for the board. Arundel was going to pay more no matter what. The real advantage of the RSU is what Arundel is getting in return for the $$ we would have spent anyway.
ReplyDeleteGood question posted a 5:48. I can't wait to hear the response. We will proably hear a bunch of nothing. The real reason is beacause they made a sound decision to purcchase out the TA contract. All the data supported a good thing for the taxpayer, and for those 6-8 grades in Arundel. Then came the fear that TA would close, even though TA said they would not. That is what this is all about. TA supporters came out in droves. They even voted down a second measure that would have given Arundel the biggest tax break.
ReplyDeleteMore inflammatory remarks! How would one assume that anyone is going to have a reasonable conversation with that? I like the comments about the Great Wall of Arundel being built. Deaf ears adds bricks. Minute by minute the wall gets bigger.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous (11:07AM), is it possible for *you* to answer my question? You sound like you've been around town for a bit, so maybe you can share your perspective.
ReplyDeleteWhat gives Arundel people the impression that the Board doesn't care? Or what gives *you* the impression the Board doesn't care, if that's your perception?
I'm just trying to understand both sides of the fence; I feel that the Board can operate in only so much of a capacity, and it is the responsibility of the district residents to keep them in check. Voting 'no' on measures isn't the only way to do it, so I'm wondering what has been done in the past that created this impression?
This is exactly why I will not answer:
ReplyDeleteGood question posted a 5:48. I can't wait to hear the response. We will proably hear a bunch of nothing. The real reason is beacause they made a sound decision to purcchase out the TA contract. All the data supported a good thing for the taxpayer, and for those 6-8 grades in Arundel. Then came the fear that TA would close, even though TA said they would not. That is what this is all about. TA supporters came out in droves. They even voted down a second measure that would have given Arundel the biggest tax break.
It reminds me the day after the May vote reading in PPH that I would burn in hell for voting no. From the very beginning post it was not going to be a productive conversation, and you absolutely have it right, the fence. I have been around town for quite sometime, and I have also spoken to many people on both sides of the issue. It really doesn't matter anyway, the Governor just signed into law legislation to withdraw January 1. This legislation passed the House and the Senate. So if all of you YES supporters want compromise, the RSU needs to lead the way. As far as I am concerned RSU 21 needs Arundel far much more than we need them. (1)
P.S. That post (11:07) was irresponsible, and intrusive to productive conversation, and very immature, inflammatory, and negative. Those comments exactly like those made by your supporters, and the board members are those same very ones that helped the no supporters. I believe you would like to have a productive conversation, as I am sure you have checked to see if there was a response, what was omitted was any effort to stop the negativity from others. That is not o.k. (1)
ReplyDelete"It reminds me the day after the May vote reading in PPH that I would burn in hell for voting no. From the very beginning post it was not going to be a productive conversation, and you absolutely have it right, the fence. I have been around town for quite sometime, and I have also spoken to many people on both sides of the issue. It really doesn't matter anyway, the Governor just signed into law legislation to withdraw January 1. This legislation passed the House and the Senate. So if all of you YES supporters want compromise, the RSU needs to lead the way. As far as I am concerned RSU 21 needs Arundel far much more than we need them. (1) "
ReplyDeleteSo, (1) what would be three things you think the RSU should work on/lead the way on?
What would be an encouraging/promising first step? (2)
Not Biting! If they can't figure it out, they never will. I more would have been more than happy to answer, but after reading that post as I explained, I would rather not get into heated discussion, but have productive discussion.(1)
ReplyDeleteThat's why I'm asking you these questions, (1) - you obviously have ideas and thoughts about it, and you have them for a reason.
ReplyDeleteI don't have the background to make the suggestions I know you have, because I haven't lived through the history of the town (I hope I'm not aging you, or miscalculating your age here, you just sound like a longtime resident).
I don't know what *I* would suggest to the Board, because I haven't seen from both sides. It's the only reason I ask. I have no reason to argue with you; not having experienced what you have, who am I to say you are incorrect in any of your perceptions?
The idea here is to throw out.. well, ideas as to how to turn things around. Or ideas to present to the Board to turn things around. Or ideas to share with our fellow residents to get feedback. I don't know. I just know that we need to make changes for all sides to work together. I'd like to know what you think would be a positive first step. (2)
Wow! The anonymous bickering is really annoying! more of the same ol same ol. You want to know why there is a wall here?? It's really simple: anyone who disagrees with Norm Archer and his croonies who like to spend money like it grows on trees gets hammered on. Let's see what did he call the people who didn't support the buyout? Oh yeah it was "anti rsu, anti education, and the biggest insult "myopic minority. This coming from the head of a board that is supposed to represent an entire community not just those that support his agenda. How about Bob Domine calling Arundel the Thorn in the animals paw" Really? You classified an entire town as a thorn and you call yourselves for "unity" yeah right. Only if we all agree to be puppets and support all you do. For all of you rsu supporters here is a big piece of concrete fact for you: I moved here from a small town in NH, we had an elementary school and were bused to the middle and highschool in our "district". When it came time to enlarge the highschool due to the housing boom we were told our tax increase would be bearable because of a grant and then an "interest free" loan. Our town was still nervous and and a majority voted no , but just like Arundel got out voted by the 2 other towns. So the glamorous new high school was built. Then the tax bills came and within 3 years they had gone up 150%. What do you think happened then? My little town emptied out as fast as it filled up. So did one of the other towns in the district who buses their student there. People actually LOST their houses due to the TAX BILL. Why? Because a standard 3 bedroom colonial on 2 acres of land no great ammenities ( no pool ect) had their tax bill go from $5000.00 to $11-12,000 A year! Can you afford $1000.00 a month on top of your mortgage? I can't! So now they have a great new high school and the classrooms are not even 3/4 full. They have senior citizens working at supermarkets to pay their TAX bill. In fact the only town that still has people moving in not out, is the town the high school is actually in. Why? Because the town that houses the high school didn't get nearly the increase the 2 other towns did. Imagine that. THAT is why we do not support the RSU. Look around you! History will show you that anytime a group of people is making financial decisions with money that they are not personally responsible for, they will ALWAYS spend more than neccessary. ALWAYS! RSU 21 can't possible justify another increase when there are less students. Yet they EXPECT it. Why not, it's not just their money and when spending someone else's money pockets always tend to be deeper. Why don't you "pro RSU people look at other rsu's budgets, then explain to me why schools that are bigger than rsu 21 can educate their kids with LESS MONEY?? Why is Arundel now paying to fix MSK when the problem occured long before consolidation? RSU 21 has one of the highest budgets there is, For what? tThere is no logical explanation for it except that Norm Archer, Maureen King, Bob Domine and the other ignorant, selfish memers who try and justify this increase don't give a damn (insert fist pounding on table here)about people who live paycheck to paycheck and are struggling to buy food and oil. I guess it's just "not their problem" or they would have worked harder at reducing the budget. They would not have lied and cheated by cutting money they didn't need and over budgeted for in the first place. Deceiptful and dishonest is what they are all about. As long as they are on the board, deceiving, cheating, and refusing to be more responsible and less frivilous with the budget this divide will continue to grow.
ReplyDeleteDanielle:
ReplyDeleteI think we've gotten to a point where we understand there's a need for change, so I'm not sure there's really any bickering. I just don't understand the Arundel viewpoint,and am trying to learn where the mistrust comes from.
If I could make a request, it's really hard for me to read what you've posted in one large paragraph (I tend to lose place easily); could you separate into paragraphs?
So, from what you've written, it appears your biggest concern is tax increases. The only thing I know at this point is that Arundel's tax increases are only in part due to the school district, but also have to do with the way the state calculated numbers, and now Arundel itself needs to increase taxes because they haven't for the past three years.
So we're getting a triple whammy.
I think that the cost sharing proposal as it was presented in May seemed like a reasonable way to mitigate the district's portion of those taxes - could anyone who voted 'no' on that explain to me why they chose to vote against it?
My understanding is that the way the formula worked previously, there was a 60/40 split, with Kennebunk and Kennebunkport taking the lesser portion. The proposed cost sharing formula appeared to redistribute that in a way that made more sense (property value, vs. enrollment numbers across the board)
While our share was disproportionately larger, it seemed as if this would help stem the tide, rather than fluctuating each year. Without that in place, it seems like there is no buffer, and that Arundel will continue to bear the larger burden based on property value, while the other two towns use enrollment numbers/property value respectively.
Is that a correct interpretation?
Based on that, what made people vote no?
One point that didn't make sense to me was that everyone seemed to be in agreement with borrowing money to repair the schools, but did not agree on the other items.
What was it about borrowing the money for repairs that was more appealing? (2)
Arundel didn't agree with the repairs, it was more I feel bad that everyone is sick.
ReplyDeleteIt wasn't just for the Middle School, though. It was a vote for any needed repairs for ML Day, as well. I hope Arundel realizes that any money set aside for those repairs will disappear as soon as paperwork is filed for withdrawal.
ReplyDeleteTHEN where will the money come from? At present, there is $350K in surplus. That money will neither maintain an elementary school, nor cover the costs of sending children to TAMS, nor will it hire a new principal and admin staff, nor will it maintain the teachers' salaries at MLD.
Where will this money come from? Those pesky taxes everyone was convinced were going to go up if the contract was bought out. I'm sad to say that folks voted *for* a tax increase by turning down the cost-sharing proposal, and if they try to withdraw, they'll be voting for an even bigger increase.
Scared MLD would close during the voting process, people voted in a reactionary fashion. If Arundel withdraws from the RSU, guess what will be on the chopping block to save money? Where will your children go to school? Additional costs will be associated with that as well.
The numbers haven't even been figured out, and folks are foaming at the mouth to 'divorce'.
Just remember: Divorce divides families. If you think that the social climate in Arundel is bad now (because of your perceptions of the RSU and how things went), wait until you completely topple the apple cart.
It takes several years for the dust to settle from consolidations and mergers in any business. Why not pull up the bootstraps and work to move forward, instead of jerking us all backward and causing upheaval? (2)
As far as the cost sharing formula: what the RSU didn't tell anyone is that Federal assistance is based on all three towns and the other two bring us up, therefore assistance goes down. Yet the formula eliminated closing a school to save money. How is that fair? We have high school choice, and don't go to middle school there so why should Arundel be burdened with the taxes for a district a Very small % of people use?
ReplyDeleteWithdrawal is the BEST thing Arundel can do as RSU 21 has proven many times, they could care less about the strain their bloated budget causes. As I stated in my last comment there are RSU's out there with double or triple the kids we have and yet they operate on a budget that is MILLIONS less than ours. In this economy we do not NEED smart boards, new auditoriums etc. That is the school board trying to dazzle up a public school that for years has had declining enrollment. It is mind boggling to me that in a time where some of us struggle to buy oil or groceries they EXPECT us to be ok with frivolous irresponsible spending.
The school board has publicly called Arundel things like "myopic" "anti RSU, Anti education, uneducated" I could go on, yet anonymous 3(6/22 6 a.m.) thinks we should let the dust settle? Let me use your reference to marriage as an example. Staying in the RSU with board members like Bob Domine, Norm Archer, and some of the others(thank God Leia Lowrey is gone) who love to call us names, and put us down would be like staying married to someone who hits you. They have done it over and over and just keep going.
We are the black sheep because we stood up for ourselves against a board with bottomless pockets and didn't blindly buy their pitch about spending.
As far as the money for ML Day, Arundel will prosper if we leave the RSU and the money will be there. We went into the RSU with 0 debt and money put away, now we have debt and all the money is gone. If we could accumulate it before the RSU we can accumulate it after.
As far as the repairs, I will always vote for repairs to ML Day, but to make Arundel pay to fix the middle school that the school board screwed up over and over is absurd.
ReplyDeleteFor Anonymous 3 you are obviously "myopic" when it comes to the RSU sales pitch. You are also unrealistic if you think for a minute that if we withdraw the new elected boards would consider closing ML Day.That is you using "scare tactics" to back up your agenda. I wonder what your motive is? Family working at the school system? Perhaps you attended yourself. Doesn't matter. They are liars and will do whatever they need to in order to get ARUNDEL'S money. They simply cannot afford to not have us.
RSU 21 needs Arundel, we do not need them!!! They need our money to fix the schools they neglected and screwed up over and over. How in God's name the schools can be in such bad shape when they have been getting more than $30 million for years on end is beyond me. Now they want to build a $40 million + high school! For what? Enrollment is down, the economy is awful and in a time when going without is as necessary as breathing they want more and more. Seriously!! There is something VERY wrong with this picture and I pray that we will be out of this mess before it is too late and people are forced out of their homes by inability to pay taxes for a school we do not even use.
Please do not give me any of this " oh you don't care about education blah blah" I lived on bare bones for a long time so my kids could go to a private Christian Academy for years, as the education there was superior to the public schools. I moved to Arundel so my kids could have high school choice & go to the school with the most to offer as far as college options. Their education is the most important thing in my life, next to God. I want more for them than I had and I am willing to go without to get them there. What I am not willing to do is be taxed out of my house for a school that our towns children do not attend, even when given the choice to go here.
Daniel. You should probably hold off on touting your christian ways on this blog. Take a look at some of your comments here and the comments you have emailed around and the only reference to god you should be making is in asking for forgiveness. Your comments and attitude are very inflammatory. I don't think god would approve of the constant name calling you so often do. Maybe you should consider praying for peace in the three towns rather than continuing to post inflammatory comments. After all, you moved here for high school choice and so I believe you do not truly care about the school system as a whole.
ReplyDelete